Originally by: Liang Nuren

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Originally by: Viper ****zIe

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So mad.

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Self describing eh?

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You obviously don't understand that motherships can be tackled in lowsec, go check the CH killboard, I'm pretty sure that they've killed about 20 of these ~invulnerable~ and ~unkillable~ ships that can ~jump out at will~ and are ruining the game.

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Yes, if you have a megablob at your back, you can kill them. Now talk to your typical 20 man pirate corp and tell me they aren't all but unkillable. Oh, I got it - let's put my whole corp in HICs so that we can get neuted out while the motherships jump out. **** that, either let my interdictor work in low sec or lose your ewar immunity.

-Liang

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Originally by: Liang Nuren

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Originally by: Ranger 1

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Big fish, little fish...

Sometimes the hardest part for the middle sized fish is to keep in mind where they are in the food chain.

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It's true. But that has nothing to do with people bringing ewar immune ships into a place where fully 3/4s of the counters don't work. If you want to bring a supercap into low sec, you should be able to be tackled by a single interceptor - just like any other carrier.

-Liang

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Originally by: Liang Nuren

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Originally by: Ranger 1

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How many counters does the typical person have that blunders unwisely into a 20 pirate camp on a low sec gate?

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It depends what you're in. If you're in anything smaller than a cruiser, you probably won't be bothered because of sentry guns preventing small fry from operating on a gate. It's pretty easy to get even battlecruisers out of big enough gatecamps - which is why the BC is the ship of choice in low sec.

-Liang

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That does nothing to address the fact that 3/4s of the supposed "counters" to supercarriers and titans don't actually work in low sec. Like I said: either make all the counters work or make them not required in the first place.

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Originally by: Liang Nuren

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Originally by: Ranger 1

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As to the

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That does nothing to address the fact that 3/4s of the supposed "counters" to supercarriers and titans don't actually work in low sec. Like I said: either make all the counters work or make them not required in the first place.

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statement, what counters that work in Null Sec but don't work in Low Sec are you referring to exactly?

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*Anchored bubbles
*Interdictor bubbles
*Hictor bubbles
Hictor focused

* Don't work in low sec

-Liang

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Originally by: Bellum Eternus

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The food chain indeed! LOL.

The groups of players who like to hotdrop SCs in lowsec are the same players that have been run out of 0.0 by larger blobs and are now content to pick on anyone smaller than they are. The reason you don't see SCs thrown around in 0.0 too often is that there are Titans on hand with DDs ready to one volley them to bits. That and the fact that 50-100 dread pilots are fairly easy to get delivered to your grid if you know what you're doing.

As for "SC pilots are always sitting around bored", I call bull****. I don't know of ONE SC pilot that either A) uses the SC on his main without having multiple PVP alts while his main is in an SC or B) simply has an SC alt dedicated to flying it. Nobody is ever just 'sitting around bored' in their SC. I haven't confined my main to the coffin that is my Nyx and I never will.

A single SC in lowsec isn't a problem in my opinion. Even an SC with a few carriers or dreads, still, not that much of a problem. It's when you get 4+ SCs remote repping each other while they're unable to be jammed to stop the remote reps (gasp! Bellum supporting ECM!) that things get a little out of hand. This is particularly the case when all the SCs are set up specifically to spidertank with all RRs, no local reps and an ultra-hardened tank. No bueno.

Liang brought it up earlier and I think it's a great idea as well, even if I do have a SC myself- SCs need to lose their EW immunity in lowsec.

Titans have lost their DD use in lowsec. This sets the precedent for the game design. There is no RP reason for it, it just is. SCs are already incredibly powerful, particularly after their massive HP boost and the addition of fighterbombers. Even with the loss of EW immunity in lowsec a group of 4-6 SCs would be almost impossible to kill without a massive blob. With the removal of EW immunity at least smaller entities would have a fighting chance of jamming the SC remote rep chain in order to slowly take down a single target before the rest cyno out.

SCs are more powerful than they ever have been. Nobody can compare a modern SC to the Motherships of old. Were x13 to try and kill an SC of today they would fail miserably. It's a good thing to have different and varied combat environments in Eve. Each area has it's own style and flavor of combat. It's clear that SCs are an 'I win' button at the moment. I think it's fair to reduce that, if only by a very small amount. If SC pilots want fights then they opposing fleet needs to have at least a -hope- of succeeding.

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